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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 4 of 4. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by temoigneur on June 2, 2006, at 17:08:52
I wrote the following to the makers of Enada, after coming across the following article by Abram Hoffer, Orthomoleclular Pioneer; has anybody heard of NAD/H in any form producing the kind of results he claims?, ..
Thanks
"Psychological Activity of Nicotinamide Adenine Dinucleotide (NAD)
In 1966 Humphry Osmond and I reported (1) that NAD was therapeutic for schizophrenic patients treated in a psychiatric wing of the University Hospital at Saskatoon.
We used an enteric coated tablet containing 100 mg suspended in an oily medium to bypass the stomach. Patients who were responding slowly to vitamin B3 in doses of 3 grams daily, responded much more quickly to NAD using 1 gram daily. For as long as the NAD was available, they remained well or much improved. When we ran out of supplies they quickly relapsed.?lt;/font>
Two negative attempts were made to repeat our work using a preparation which was dumped into the stomach of patients who had been maintained on the backwards of the mental hospitals of that era and were sick for many years. (2) These two negative reports effectively quenched interest in this compound until a few years ago.
Professor J.G.D. Birkmayer and his associates at the Birkmayer Institute for Parkinson Therapy in Vienna, Austria, studied a stable form of NADH. They found that their stable preparation using 5 mg doses was therapeutic for Parkinson's disease, for Alzheimer's, and for depression. (3) They wrote," When we first used NADH with regard to its clinical efficacy the effect was not convincing.?lt;/font>
This was most likely due to the rapid dissolution (approximately 10-15 minutes) of the capsule leading to a release of NADH into the acid conditions of the stomach. Since NADH is rapidly oxidized below pH 7.6, the conditions in the stomach will inactivate NADH by converting it to NAD.
The investigations of this report were therefore performed with NADH capsules coated with an acid stable film and a release time of 2-3 hours. With this galenic formulation of NADH an improvement in disability could be achieved which was comparable to that of intravenously applied NADH."
In our studies we used NAD, which was the only form of this coenzyme available, in doses of one gram daily, but the Austrian group found NADH active at 5 to 10 mg daily.
NAD and NADH are interconvertable in the body.This suggests that the active form is the reduced form, NADH, and that NAD is much less effective since it would first have to be reduced to NADH. The decreasing order of therapeutic efficacy would be NADH, NAD and finally vitamin B3. There would be no formation of NADH in the stomach from NAD, but there would be some made in the intestine.
I hope these recent Birkmayer studies will reactivate interest in the therapeutic effect of this potent coenzyme made from vitamin B3. It is available from Menuco Corporation, 350 Fifth Avenue, Suite 7509, New York, NY 10118"
******so I [temoigneur] asked *******
Do you sell a form of NAD/NADH that could bypass the stomach like hoffer's original preparation. If so, is it posssible to know what dose of your product would be equivalent to Hoffers' enteric coated tablet of 100mg NAD.
Here's the webpage he cited you on;
http://www.doctoryourself.com/hoffer_anecdote.htmlIf this is a viable theory, does anyone if there is a preparation of NAD/H that could bypass the stomach, and how to get it... I'm waiting for the reply from Enada
Posted by Larry Hoover on June 2, 2006, at 18:41:51
In reply to Enada and schizophrenia, does this make sense, posted by temoigneur on June 2, 2006, at 17:08:52
A quick reply: Hoffer was laughed at. He persisted. I think he was right. They laughed at Linus Pauling, too. He won *2* Nobel prizes. Pauling won two of them.
Enada is enteric-coated stabilized NADH. Its description is precisely what Hoffer used.
But I must warn you. 100 mg is quite a substantial dose of this substance.
Remember, schizophrenia is not just a single disorder, either. Just like depression. Schizophrenia is a symptom cluster, just like depression. There are different causes, in different people.
iherb had a great price on Enada not very long ago. Enada is a trademarked product, so many different companies are licensed to sell it. They should be the same stuff. Just go for the best price.
Here's what Hoffer has to say about medical science, vis a vis vitamins:
http://www.internetwks.com/pauling/hoffer.html
Lar
Posted by temoigneur on June 2, 2006, at 21:04:03
In reply to Re: Enada and schizophrenia, does this make sense ?temoigneur, posted by Larry Hoover on June 2, 2006, at 18:41:51
> A quick reply: Hoffer was laughed at. He persisted. I think he was right. They laughed at Linus Pauling, too. He won *2* Nobel prizes. Pauling won two of them.
>
> Enada is enteric-coated stabilized NADH. Its description is precisely what Hoffer used.
>
> But I must warn you. 100 mg is quite a substantial dose of this substance.
>
> Remember, schizophrenia is not just a single disorder, either. Just like depression. Schizophrenia is a symptom cluster, just like depression. There are different causes, in different people.
>
> iherb had a great price on Enada not very long ago. Enada is a trademarked product, so many different companies are licensed to sell it. They should be the same stuff. Just go for the best price.
>
> Here's what Hoffer has to say about medical science, vis a vis vitamins:
>
> http://www.internetwks.com/pauling/hoffer.html
>
> Lar
> Enada is enteric-coated stabilized NADH. Its description is precisely what Hoffer used.
>
> But I must warn you. 100 mg is quite a substantial dose of this substance.To my knowledge, Enada is sold in 5 and 10mg tablets... would 100mg Enada = 100mg of hoffer's NAD. If so, would taking 1g of Enada be safe... I can't believe this hasn't been pursued more vigorously, if Hoffer thought the formuolation would effect remission in days... anyways, thank you so much for your help, and direction...
> Remember, schizophrenia is not just a single disorder, either. Just like depression. Schizophrenia is a symptom cluster, just like depression. There are different causes, in different people.
That's certainly what I've been reading.. schizophrenia as a syndrome.. I'm going to be tested for "cerebral allergy", and keep investigating mineral vitamin deficiencies, and perhaps even metal testing.
Thank you larry
Posted by kalloco on June 23, 2006, at 18:05:28
In reply to Re: Enada and schizophrenia, does this make sense, posted by temoigneur on June 2, 2006, at 21:04:03
I've heard and read an account of a schizophrenia case, custodial care for nearly a decade, that responded to EFA supplementation. As EFA deficiency is epidemic in many regions, perhaps this would be a consideration?
> > A quick reply: Hoffer was laughed at. He persisted. I think he was right. They laughed at Linus Pauling, too. He won *2* Nobel prizes. Pauling won two of them.
> >
> > Enada is enteric-coated stabilized NADH. Its description is precisely what Hoffer used.
> >
> > But I must warn you. 100 mg is quite a substantial dose of this substance.
> >
> > Remember, schizophrenia is not just a single disorder, either. Just like depression. Schizophrenia is a symptom cluster, just like depression. There are different causes, in different people.
> >
> > iherb had a great price on Enada not very long ago. Enada is a trademarked product, so many different companies are licensed to sell it. They should be the same stuff. Just go for the best price.
> >
> > Here's what Hoffer has to say about medical science, vis a vis vitamins:
> >
> > http://www.internetwks.com/pauling/hoffer.html
> >
> > Lar
>
>
> > Enada is enteric-coated stabilized NADH. Its description is precisely what Hoffer used.
> >
> > But I must warn you. 100 mg is quite a substantial dose of this substance.
>
> To my knowledge, Enada is sold in 5 and 10mg tablets... would 100mg Enada = 100mg of hoffer's NAD. If so, would taking 1g of Enada be safe... I can't believe this hasn't been pursued more vigorously, if Hoffer thought the formuolation would effect remission in days... anyways, thank you so much for your help, and direction...
>
> > Remember, schizophrenia is not just a single disorder, either. Just like depression. Schizophrenia is a symptom cluster, just like depression. There are different causes, in different people.
>
> That's certainly what I've been reading.. schizophrenia as a syndrome.. I'm going to be tested for "cerebral allergy", and keep investigating mineral vitamin deficiencies, and perhaps even metal testing.
>
> Thank you larry
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