![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
First and foremost, this a wonderful Group. Dr. Bob has done a wonderful thing. From late September of last year to about two months ago I was on the forum anywhere from once a day to ten times a day. (Perhaps there is a record of the number of visits made from my ISP to the site)
I was searching for answers to a crippling depression. I had been relatively free from depression for over 20 years but it returned with a vengeance beginning July 31st, 2009.
I treated it with Parnate, had a very unsuccessful attempt with Remeron and utilized Lithium briefly. Nothing worked. Nothing changed.I was 61, unemployed lonely, single, isolated, living in a foreign country, recovering reasonably well from open heart surgery, etc, etc.
Problems seemed overwhelming. I could not afford to move back to the U.S. although I was never confident that that was a solution.I read hundreds maybe thousands of postings searching for answers. I posted perhaps 30-40 times in 9 months.
In January of 2010, I made some decisions.
1) i found a therapist in Costa Rica, i had been out of therapy since I moved here 20 years ago and had been highly skeptical of finding a therapist who would understand the complexities of my life, given the differences in my cultural background, etc.2) I began to attend a mental health self help group that was not easy to find. This was not as good as individual therapy but it got me out of the house at night and was an activity
3) I overcame certain inhibitions and began to attend a gay men's social group on Saturday afternoons.
4) I wrote a proposal for a project in my field of specialization, which is public health.
5) I decided to stop taking Vicodin for prostate pain, and I went twice a week for several months to NA groups. But my Vicodin dose had always been two pills per day maximum. So it wasn't hard to stop. I took my last Vicodin on Jan. 6, 2010.
6) I decided to be more pro active about starting to date.
7) I never stopped taking Parnate, as much as 40 mg per day, and sometimes 30 mg per day. During 6 weeks I took it with Lithium but didn't see any impact from the Lithium. I trusted the Parnate which I had taken for perhaps an average of 8 months out of the year for the past 27 years.
Things began to change. In May, my proposal was accepted. not much money but finally a job. my anxiety level rose because this meant that I had to be able to do the work.
I became a "regular" at the gay social group and began to join the group members going out to dinner or to a bar after the group. I felt accepted by the group.
In therapy i worked on issues that I hadn't touched in 20 years.
From January through about June 15th the depressio continued with still many days of feeling suicidal at least part of the day. But I was also aware that i had made conscious decisions to make changes.
I continued to attend the mental health support group, sometimes twice a week.
I dropped the NA groups. I had no desire anymore for Vicodin, and I have never tried crack, coke, ecstasy,etc, nor do I drink alcohol. I really felt like I was there looking for friends more than wanting or needing to "work the program" So I let it go. The people I was trying to befriend were in a life or struggle, but it was not my struggle, which was depression, not drugs, and I probably had no right to be there if I was there to meet people and not work the program, as they say.
I began to enjoy my job. The endogenous part of the depression was always there, somewhat responsive to the parnate but it never lifted completely.
Until one night after the gay group when I sat next to a younger attractive guy who put his leg against mine. We talked and became good friends but never went to bed. But the moment that I felt the depression life, was the moment that my leg touched Melvin's for maybe an hour during our conversation.
From the next morning on, (this was June 15th) I realized that it was lonliness that was killing me more than anything else.
I kept up my program of individual and group therapy and increased my level of social activities. The platonic relationship with Melvin, was frustrating (since I was so physically attracted to him)_ but even without the sex, it was tremendously energizing like a boyhood crush.
Along with the energized feeling, the boyhood crush, I noticed that the endogenous features of the depression began to life with greater and greater frequency. Although it still never occurred to me to stop the Parnate. I did resolve to stop my habit of watching porn on the internet at night and masturbating (twice a week or so) becaues I realize that my libido was stimulating me to meet people, and masturbation affected my libido.
The end of Parnate (temporarily or longer I hope) simply came about as a result of a simple dentist's appointment. As I always do and even though dental anesthesia is safe, I stopped my Parnate 3 days before the appointment, worried about the impace of this.
Much to my surprise there was no change in my mood. I stayed my normal self. This was about June 15th, now two months ago. Since that day I have taken no more Parnate.
Stopping Parnate is an upper as long as you don't have crippling depression. there are no more sexual side effects, no insomnia, I can't eat without the worry of a hypertensive crisis, I don't have to worry about drug interactions, etc. etc. etc. Parnate is a wonderful drug with some miserable consequences. So now I am two months Parnate free.
I now work hard on my job, and am rather instensively dating someone, which feels real good.
I still go to individual therapy and to the self support groups. But the groups I go to kind out of loyalty and not so much out of need. But I want the group to be there for me if and when I need it again. So I go.
I still participate even more actively in the gay social group, and held a party for everyone here at my apartment 3 weekends ago.I have probably visited psychobabble maybe once or twice in the past month. I don't feel the curiousity or intensive need that I felt. This is fine I think. Its there if and when I need it.
So my not participating as before in terms of reading so many posts is not negative. Its a result of a diminishing need to be on the site.
I dont know how true this for other babblers who just diaappear from time to time.I also cannot say that I am not in a biological cycle that could change without any apparent cause. This was the belief of my treating Psychiatrist in chicago many years ago. That it wasn't real life events but a biochemical cycle. I always disagreed somewhat with this interpretaton, because I feel that these real life events, like getting a job, a boyfriend, keeping busy, being out of the house much more, etc have been a major factor in my improvement.
I don't count any unhatched chickens. I find it miraculous that I feel as good as I do. I feel capble of monitoring myself to know that if a signficant depression develops that I will start on the parnte again.
I feel that psychobabble is there when I need it.
It was interesting to return tonight and read a few complete threads, but I felt totally different than I did 3 - 0 months ago. I don't really seem to "need" it at this moment, so I have mostly disappeared.anyway, that is my story for the moment.
Rick in Costa Rica
Please esxuse as this has not been proof read. I am falling asleep....and need to send this before I collapse int sleep.Simcere;u.
Rick fromCostaRica.
Posted by atypical on August 9, 2010, at 23:26:30
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
Rick,
Thank you so much for your honest posting. I feel we share many parallels in terms of our experiences in and out of depression.
You hit on something that deep down I know is at the root of my depression too: loneliness. No medical treatment can replace the feeling of being loved romantically by someone and loving him or her back. No amount of Nardil nor any other medication or treatment can do that. When I have felt that love, I have felt safe and joyful like never before. I am more joyful at work. I feel more effortless. I have many friends and am outwardly quite social and humorous. And I am very active. But deep inside I am so lonely and I experience almost no pleasure or joy in being alive. I, too, have joined a group which helps me feel more connected. But I won't stop my medication just yet. My last friendship/relationship ended and I'm feeling empty and depressed--lost. I know I can't completely rely on someone else for my own happiness, but I feel like for my own wellness, at least for now, I do. And I'll carry on with medical treatments to see if they help keep me stable so I can continue to pursue relationship.
Atpyical
Posted by Phillipa on August 10, 2010, at 0:11:12
In reply to Re: Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by atypical on August 9, 2010, at 23:26:30
I feel it's true the more you do the more you accomplish, the more positive things that happen to you the better you feel and less need for meds. I know that for at least 25 years after first panic attack I only used valium as needed during school and working. Now not working and find myself here a lot. getting out and about it important thanks for the posts. And Rick that's wonderful so happy for you. Phillipa
Posted by jensen on August 10, 2010, at 8:59:16
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
The reasons posters come and go are as varied as individuals. I dont believe it good to root and roost on any site such as this. A lot of regulars come and go. Just studying the posts, the top reasons for going are doing well, doing too unwell or an incident happens between posters or adm causing exits. The top reasons for staying long periods are complex. It would be uncivil and unfair to give my ideas of speculation. The main goal for a lot is to obtain a good real life which has been thwarted by illness. Babble can be helpful but prolonged exposure isnt the way that is going to happen, imo. I am glad for you Rick & hope you continue to improve.
Posted by Maxime on August 10, 2010, at 9:35:25
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
I can't answer your question but I just want to say "congratulations" on being so proactive with your mental health. All the groups you attended made a big difference I am sure. Keep it up!
Posted by PartlyCloudy on August 10, 2010, at 11:32:54
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
So good to hear that you're doing well.
I'm one of those people who participated quite intensely here, left for a while and am dipping my toes in the waters again.
I, too, am a changed person from the one who originally sought out the site. I believe there are many reasons that people decide to stop participating here, and, as another poster has indicated, it's not always within the parameters of the civility guidelines to speculate on exactly why that happens.
Sites evolve; posters' individual needs evolve; their relationship to the site also evolve.
PartlyCloudy
Posted by atypical on August 10, 2010, at 12:13:49
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
I'll add that, generally speaking, I stop participating in Psychobabble when I feel well. When I don't feel as well I feel like I need the information, support, etc. of being on psychobabble.
Posted by angels78 on August 10, 2010, at 21:00:30
In reply to Re: Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by atypical on August 10, 2010, at 12:13:49
same here.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 11, 2010, at 4:00:22
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
Kirby, how nice it feels to read your post. I'm so glad you see well--and drug-free! I guess life can throw a (happy) surprise into a depressed person's life. :)
Posted by kirbyw on August 11, 2010, at 13:01:39
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
Thanks for all the supportive responses. Believe me, I still have plenty of ups and downs, but I am trying to manage them with therapy and with my own "emotional resources." Being Parnate free does make a big difference in terms of my ability to interact intimately. I may have neglected that I do take 3 mg of Clonazapam (Rivotril) daily and I seem need it mostly in the morning when I feel very irritable and stressed. But the side effects of Rivotril are far less than Parnate. And I am not really taking it for depression so much as for stress and irritability.
And the overall "impact' of Parnate on the body is just so powerful. Its a great drug, not prescribed enough in very severe depression to get people out of the bed and back into life, but the totality of its impact, especially in an older persons is also very dramatic.
Again, I have been back on psychobabble, looking at the responses to my post and I think they have been very supportive and interesting. Of course, to everyone who has responded I also hope that things improve. We all need improvement.
sincerely
Rick
Posted by sigismund on August 11, 2010, at 15:05:50
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
>But the moment that I felt the depression life, was the moment that my leg touched Melvin's for maybe an hour during our conversation.
Rick, what a lovely story. I'm touched.
Posted by tom2228 on August 13, 2010, at 22:14:04
In reply to Re: Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by sigismund on August 11, 2010, at 15:05:50
kirby, your post touched me too and I want to let you know that it is giving me inspiration in a time when I really need it.. thanks. And also I'm really happy for you!
So. I only joined earlier this summer after being an onlooker for a few years -- first for info, lately for intellectual curiosity and support as I've begun to aggressively treat and attempt to squash my issues before I set off for college later this month. I didn't even post here for long at all, and just a couple of posts. But for some reason I stopped.
I need to post, post SOMETHING here. Perhaps it's because I'm coming up on my dose of Desoxyn (methamphetamine -- no, I'm not at all high or trying to be. I have severe ADHD; I simply feel like my brain is turning on.)... Or that I am realizing that I very much need to look my mental illness, the enemy, directly in the eye, even though it is like trying to stare at the sun. But it is the only way to learn of its weak spot(s) and take the beast down before it does the same to me. I am leaving in 14 days and I desperately need to be in a good place mentally.
I cannot say why I stopped posting, approx a month and a half ago, because I don't know the answer myself. And I do not mean to make this a drawn out diary entry but know that by putting this into words and publishing it, I am both accepting, and making the first step towards changing the fact that, I am lost.
It is so hard to ground yourself when you aren't even aware that you have lifted off... it's as if my mental illness pulled me away like a rip current -- and finally last night it was my therapist who blew the whistle and allowed me to see that I had drifted off.
When I joined here I was on shaky ground. I had been doing very well on Vyvanse + Trileptal, in terms of ADHD, depression, and mood stability. But my mood began to fall. It was a thread on here, the one about Hunk's seemingly life-changing experience with Nardil, that inspired me to realize that I had problems I wasn't addressing (social phobia), and this explained the low I was falling into.
So I decided I needed to aggressively treat my issues and started on MAOIs (Emsam), joining Babble to ask some questions... but for some reason I stopped posting shortly after starting Parnate. I guess as I started to feel different I just got caught up in the feelings of the new medicines..
The original post of this thread allowed me to see the problem. While it IS good to have faith that your medicines will work, I thought these miraculous MAOIs would save me. Knowing my treatment was getting into the area of very advanced pharmacotherapy, all I focused on was how to find the perfect last-resort combo that would take me to a tropical resort getaway in happyland.
I indeed got away.. from myself. I haven't been able to post because I've been too detatched, unstable, and unclear to function really. Thanks to this thread I'm realizing that mental illness, for us psychobabblers, will always be a part of who we truly are, and even the BEST meds won't erase our emotions from our subconscious. My current combo of Parnate, Desoxyn, and Depakote is far from perfect, and I must accept that it's going to take a lot more time than before I leave for school to get it right.
The lesson I'm learning here is that that meds cannot be a cure, rather they are a tool. Surely they will cross the BBB and get into my brain, but they're not gonna do jack sh1T for me unless I find a way, and the right way, to let them in my soul.
So I guess this isn't really a reason why people stop participating on Babble, but more so just another post that conveys a similar meaning to kirby's... most of us here are continually searching for the right med that's gonna let them get on with their life, perhaps effecting them to leave babble, but we must never forget what it is that brought us here in the first place. as much as we'd like to be free from the troubles we have, it is clear to me now that is doesn't matter how close attention we pay to the neuropsychopharmacology of our drug cocktails if we're not paying the same attention to our emotions and feelings. therapy has been immensely helpful to me and I wouldn't have made a fraction of the progress I've made without it.
And I realize that this post really could do with some summarization, lol. But as these are my true feelings, and I'm realizing how important it is not to ignore them, I don't want to edit this. So thanks to all who have taken the time to read it.
P.S. My god, this is the first post -- or any writing document, really -- that I have written LINEARLY rather than stopping every other sentence to spit out my randomly flowing ideas on the page before I forget them, then piecing the whole thing together -- which usually is such a struggle for me that I quit altogether. Thank you, Desoxyn (today is day 4)!!! I guess it looks like things are starting to look up for me ?!
Best wishes to all,
Tom
Posted by Laney on August 15, 2010, at 13:43:03
In reply to First post in a while.. this is a step., posted by tom2228 on August 13, 2010, at 22:14:04
I wanted to say that I stopped posting because all of the information that I've read can be quite confusing and unsettling. I also stopped because I wasn't getting any feedback or at least not much. I tried to get one babbler to reply to my questions but he blew me off and I didn't understand why.
Laney
Posted by ed_uk2010 on August 15, 2010, at 14:53:52
In reply to Re: Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by sigismund on August 11, 2010, at 15:05:50
>Rick, what a lovely story. I'm touched.
Likewise.
Posted by ed_uk2010 on August 15, 2010, at 14:59:23
In reply to Re: First post in a while.. this is a step., posted by Laney on August 15, 2010, at 13:43:03
>all of the information that I've read can be quite confusing and unsettling.
There are many different opinions out there. The many posters have completely different experiences, attitudes and theories.... and give conflicting advice.
>....he blew me off.
Are you sure? Everyone has a life outside babble. Responses to posts are often delayed. Sometimes, posts can be missed entirely.
Take care.
Posted by PartlyCloudy on August 15, 2010, at 20:37:54
In reply to First post in a while.. this is a step., posted by tom2228 on August 13, 2010, at 22:14:04
Great post.
Thanks for coming back and writing. Just WRITING here has helped me over the years (yes, years) through different aspects of my recovery, my setbacks, and growth.
There is a great deal of support here too that I believe is simply unavailable to many of us due to the isolation that our illness has created. For that I am very grateful.
(Nice to meet you.)
PartlyCloudy
Posted by bearfan on August 16, 2010, at 2:37:24
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
Probably because some of them got better and didn't frequent the board as much due to life activities.
Posted by simcha on August 18, 2010, at 16:21:39
In reply to Why do people stop participating in psychobabble?, posted by kirbyw on August 9, 2010, at 22:49:19
Kirbyw, congratulations! It sounds like you're doing very well.
I too am trying to expand my social circles. I'm starting to get involved in a Unitarian Universalist Church that is very affirming of GLBTQI people such as me. Also they don't require any belief, really. They support one another on their own spiritual journeys wherever they lead. I need a spiritual community again and I don't really want to go back to the synagogue I used to attend before my father died over 4 years ago. I'm trying something new.
I went back to Al-Anon (for friends and families of alcoholics) for a year last year and I found that I couldn't keep going. I just wasn't getting the support I needed. I started going to Al-Anon originally 15 years ago. It just doesn't work like it used to, for some reason.
My experience is similar to others on this board. I don't even read the posts on this site when I'm feeling well again. However, when I come out of remission and I'm depressed yet again. I come here to read about the latest treatments and other people's experiences with them. Also I write to share a bit and get some support with the decisions I'm making for my own treatment. This site has been a stable presence on the Internet for a long time. I think I've been here on and off for 9ish years? Whenever I've stopped by, I feel better and more informed. It helps knowing others who are dealing with some of the same things that I deal with.
Posted by simcha on August 18, 2010, at 23:30:25
In reply to Re: First post in a while.. this is a step., posted by Laney on August 15, 2010, at 13:43:03
Yes, I find that I didn't get responses often in the past. And today I've asked a couple of serious questions in new threads and I feel like I've been completely ignored. Then again, I'm depressed again and feeling a lot of things that don't make sense. And yet, why hasn't anyone responded to me? Ugh! I hate feeling this way.
Posted by Phillipa on August 19, 2010, at 19:47:54
In reply to Re: First post in a while.. this is a step. » Laney, posted by simcha on August 18, 2010, at 23:30:25
Simcha I've read your threads and don't know what meds will read again. Phillipa
Posted by simcha on August 20, 2010, at 13:57:04
In reply to Re: First post in a while.. this is a step. » simcha, posted by Phillipa on August 19, 2010, at 19:47:54
Phillipa, it's OK. I'm over-reacting because I'm depressed. Intellectually I know that. My feelings are another story...
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.