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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Willow on December 3, 2001, at 21:57:55
Thought this news article may be of interest to some
http://www.msnbc.com/news/636570.aspTalks about brain shrinkage and a drug that works the opposite way of the usual ADs. I haven't finished reading it, but figured I'd post a link.
Willow
Posted by SLS on December 4, 2001, at 7:52:48
In reply to European Drug, posted by Willow on December 3, 2001, at 21:57:55
> Thought this news article may be of interest to some
> http://www.msnbc.com/news/636570.asp
>
> Talks about brain shrinkage and a drug that works the opposite way of the usual ADs. I haven't finished reading it, but figured I'd post a link.
>
> Willow
Hi Willow.This study was referred to in another thread. Tianeptine (Stablon) is a drug that increases the reuptake of serotonin. This is in contrast to SSRIs that decrease reuptake.
This I find disturbing:
< from article >
"Indeed, the studies that discovered hippocampal shrinkage were done on people who had recovered from depression after the use of older medications, Sapolsky said."
I was under the impression that the shrinkage was reversed with all antidepressants and ECT, as long as remission was achieved. I'm afraid to look into this. I doubt I'll like what I find. :-(
- Scott
Posted by Willow on December 4, 2001, at 17:18:07
In reply to Re: European Drug, posted by SLS on December 4, 2001, at 7:52:48
"Tianeptine (Stablon) is a drug that increases the reuptake of serotonin. This is in contrast to SSRIs that decrease reuptake."
Near the end of the article it said that the medication hasn't had much success in treating depression, but perhaps it may help people who haven't had success with the mainstream drugs?
Willow
Posted by jazzdog on December 4, 2001, at 18:37:41
In reply to Re: European Drug, posted by SLS on December 4, 2001, at 7:52:48
Hi Scott -
If you do look into it, I hope you post your findings. A lot of my symptoms are cognitive, and an atrophied hippocampus sounds just about right.
- Jane
Posted by jay on December 6, 2001, at 10:37:17
In reply to Re: European Drug, posted by SLS on December 4, 2001, at 7:52:48
> > Thought this news article may be of interest to some
> > http://www.msnbc.com/news/636570.asp
> >
> > Talks about brain shrinkage and a drug that works the opposite way of the usual ADs. I haven't finished reading it, but figured I'd post a link.
> >
> > Willow
>
>
> Hi Willow.
>
> This study was referred to in another thread. Tianeptine (Stablon) is a drug that increases the reuptake of serotonin. This is in contrast to SSRIs that decrease reuptake.
>
> This I find disturbing:
>
> < from article >
>
> "Indeed, the studies that discovered hippocampal shrinkage were done on people who had recovered from depression after the use of older medications, Sapolsky said."
>
> I was under the impression that the shrinkage was reversed with all antidepressants and ECT, as long as remission was achieved. I'm afraid to look into this. I doubt I'll like what I find. :-(
>
>
> - ScottScott:
Damn, this does scare me, and maybe it's not best to post this...I just don't know...damn...we all really don't, looking for relief.
As far as the meds they have now...in particular in North America, I think the numbers aren't even that optomistic, really. Most studies on new drugs last for such a short period of time.
I *still* find, for the really toughest of times, many drugs that aren't "conventional" for depression and anxiety work...those being benzo's, booze, and pot. I still find everyday brings uncertainty and my 'traditional' medications, a.d's and a.p's, really don't do a hell of a lot. I am *not* suggesting anybody stop their meds on a whim, as I wouldn't even do that unless under horrid circumstances, but I really think the whole industry looks at depression/anxiety as a short-term thing, and should be looking at lives, and quality of life, after 10, 20, 30 etc years. But, patents expire by then...and that doesn't seem to count when it comes to the "bottom line".
I am sorry if I am cynical...I am a very pro-drug person, as we live such a short life, I think we have a right to ingest substances to make our lives better. (Some disagree on what is "better"...but can anybody blame a crack user trying to survive in the Bronx? A whole other topic...the "War on Drugs" crappola..)
Well...I am just ranting...but I think we have EVERY right to alter our minds to feel and live as best as possible. Maybe small doses of both amphetamines and benzos do more for depression and anxiety than *any* antidepressant out there.
Jay....< sigh >
Posted by jazzdog on December 6, 2001, at 12:08:46
In reply to Re: European Drug...Scared too!! » SLS, posted by jay on December 6, 2001, at 10:37:17
Jay - Of course everyone has the right to do what they want with their own brain chemistry, but it's important to know the long-term consequences. I met a woman in rehab who'd been addicted for years to a benzo-pot-booze combo. She was 53, and her short-term memory was so shot she couldn't remember where she was for more than ten minutes at a time. The doctor said her brain damage was irreversible. Scared the **** out of me, so I looked into it. This combination seems to be particularly hard on the brain cells, especially short-term memory. Just something to keep in mind.
- Jane
Posted by gilbert on December 6, 2001, at 16:37:57
In reply to Re: European Drug...Scared too!! » jay, posted by jazzdog on December 6, 2001, at 12:08:46
I was going to post but forgot what I wanted to say.......LOL just kidding. I did notice that my short term memory was off while on xanax, like I watch Jeopardy and I know the answer but it won't
come out of my mouth......it was weird like I was stuck ina brain rut....I am currently going off the xanax and hope I improve after or rejuvinate. As far as the antidepressants especially the ssri's there is ample data on the web if you search showing increases of cortisol as being the culprit or hypothesized culprit of brain shrinkage.....All ssri's cause increases in corisol....does that mean They shrink your brain...I don't know but I do know alot of people
would already be dead or not functioning without them. There has always been a price to pay for taking all medications....especially pysch drugs. Even other drugs effect liver enzymes etc. Like I said in my earlier post we need some new drugs. Safer more effective, less addictive.
I hope some biochemist out there cares.Gil
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