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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 6 of 6. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lynne on July 22, 2000, at 22:06:01
Does Adrafinil make anyone else tired? It doesn't matter if I take 300mgs or 1200mgs, I can't get off the couch. I also take Ritalin SR 40mgs in the am. I take 25mgs Seroquel to help me sleep at night(always had insomnia). I am also feel depressed. I have been on this combo for 1 month. Should I add something for depression or what? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Lynne
Posted by shellie on July 23, 2000, at 10:14:26
In reply to ADRAFINIL makes me tired! Anyone else??, posted by Lynne on July 22, 2000, at 22:06:01
> Does Adrafinil make anyone else tired? It doesn't matter if I take 300mgs or 1200mgs, I can't get off the couch. I also take Ritalin SR 40mgs in the am. I take 25mgs Seroquel to help me sleep at night(always had insomnia). I am also feel depressed. I have been on this combo for 1 month. Should I add something for depression or what? Any help would be appreciated.
> Thanks,
> LynneHi Lynne. I had the reaction to provigil that you are having to adrafinil--(they are related drugs), extreme fatigue all the time and I had to go off. Is the adrafinil helping with anything? If it makes you so tired, I might consider going off, then seeing where you are in terms of your depression. If you are having some positive effects besides the tirededness, adding an antidepressant might to the trick. Or you might want to look up the thread "Zyprexa or Ampisulpride" --7/15-7/22--its about what is working for Karen B. with adrafinil. shellie
Posted by AndrewB on July 23, 2000, at 19:55:10
In reply to Re: ADRAFINIL makes me tired! Anyone else?? » Lynne, posted by shellie on July 23, 2000, at 10:14:26
Lynne,
Adrafinil doesn't necessarily work by the same mechanisms as Provigil. From reading the posts here it does seem like they work in different ways. (Does anybody know how adrafinil works!) Having not responded to adrafinil, you can now try another arousal agent that works in a different manner such as Provigil or reboxetine. I personally would try Provigil next because it seems possible a negative response to provigil predicts a positive response to adrafinil and possibly visa versa. Have you tried wellbutrin? Concerning reboxetine, I suggest that before trying reboxetine one should try .01% Naphazoline eye drops (with no other active ingrediants). It is my impression that a positive arousal response to these eye drops would likely mean a positive response to reboxetine.
AndrewB
Posted by Lynne on July 23, 2000, at 20:36:10
In reply to Re: ADRAFINIL makes me tired! Lynne, posted by AndrewB on July 23, 2000, at 19:55:10
AndrewB and Shellie,
Thanks for your answering my posts.I have tried Provigil before and it made me extremly tired and zombie like. I gave it a fair trail and used it for 2 weeks at different doseages.After reading so much about Adrafinil, I decided to order some(2 boxes) and wait the three to four weeks to see if it would help. I was so excited to hear of all the positive experiences on this board. I then order 5 more boxes which should arrive this week. GREAT,now I have decided not to take it anymore. I guess I'll just throw it in the cabinette with my other collection of meds that didn't work.(don't know why I save any of them)!
I took your advice Shellie and didn't take any Adrafinil today and I decided to go back and try Effexor XR again. Well, I do feel better today, so it must be not taking the Adrafinil. I want to try Reboxitine but how do I get it? Can I mail order for it? Hopefully it will soon be approved in the US.
Thanks Again,
Lynne
Posted by AndrewB on July 24, 2000, at 0:29:14
In reply to Re: ADRAFINIL makes me tired! Lynne( reply), posted by Lynne on July 23, 2000, at 20:36:10
Lynne,
Farmacia Cerati supplies reboxetine for those with an Rx
www.farmaciacerati.it/
$32 for 60x4mg. + approx. $10 for shippingSee my post below concernig why provigil can make a person feel worse. Some of it is relevant to you.
Further information on using Naphazoline eye drops to predict if reboxetine will work is below.
AndrewB
============================Naphazoline
Reboxetine takes approximately 2 weeks, sometimes longer to take effect. This drug has been wonderful for many people, providing mental and physical arousal sometimes along with an antidepressant effect. However many people either don’t respond to the medicines or experience intolerable side effects.
Naphazoline, when taken in the form of eye drops, offers a way to predict whether one will respond reboxetine and possibly other drugs that act mainly on the alpha 1 andrenergic receptor. Naphazoline eye drops are used to get redness out of the eyes by constricting the blood vessels.
It acts in seconds to minutes. When it works, one’s tiredness, lack of mental clarity or mood should improve. Simply put a drop in each eye, as instructed below. Wait 10 minutes. If no effect is felt, add two more drops. Repeat if necessary. Watch your pulse. Your pulse should increase as the naph. takes effect. I suggest you not let your resting heart rate go above the low 90s. When naph.’s effects begin to wear off and you begin to ‘drag’ again, you will have to apply more drops to reinvigorate the effect. This may be once a day, for others it may be six or more times a day. For some the drops may be too strong. In this case simply dilute with normal sterile saline solution.
Naphazoline is an alpha agonist with a short onset of action and a short half life. Basically, its action is through the same receptors as reboxetine but the onset of the arousal effect is much more rapid. I take reboxetine and the arousal effect I experience from it is about the same as I feel when I take Naphazoline.
You can take Naphazoline on an ongoing basis though the label instructions advise against it. But in fact, some Chronic Fatigue Immune Disorder Syndrome (CFIDS) specialists have some of their patients taking these eye drops for years. My impression though is that most people will experience a rapid tolerance to its effects.
Naphazoline can be purchased at the local drug store under a variety of tradenames such as Vasocon and Naphcon. A prescription is not required. I paid about $14 for 15mL in the US and about half that in Canada. Read the box before you buy. It should list as active ingredients Naphazoline Hydrochloride at an approximate strength of 0.01%. Naph. should contain no other active ingredients. Brands that have ‘A’s at the end of their trade names, such as VasoconA and NaphconA, contain an antihistamine also as an active ingredient. Do not buy these.
It is my guess that people will experience some (but not all) of the same side effects on Naph. as they would with adrafinil or reboxetine. For example, if Naph. gives one agitation, anxiety, or sexual side effects, there is a good chance reboxetine or adrafinil will do the same. I think reboxetine though can give a person side effects that you wouldn’t get with either Naph. or adrafinil.
Too much Naph. may cause headaches, anxiety, agitation, insomnia, sweating, rapid heart beat. Do not take it if you have high blood pressure or cardiac disease as the medicine will raise blood pressure and can induce arrythmias.
Not everyone who takes the eye drops will see much of an effect with them. I believe only those with alpha andrenergic system hypofunction will experience improvement when taking naphazoline. Those who don’t see an improvement are unlikely to benefit from taking drugs like reboxetine. But those who do improve after taking the eye drops will, if I am right, also improve (side effects aside) on reboxetine. Here is the real value of naphazoline; it predicts whether you would benefit from a class of drugs. If it is able to do this, it will save a nonresponding person the ordeal of a failed drug trial and, on the other hand, point the responder in the direction of an effective medicine for them.
Those with a PROPERLY functioning alpha andrenergic system will experience:
+less redness in eyes
+increased BP
+possibly increased heart rate
+At higher doses possibly headache or restlessnessThose with a IMPROPERLY functioning alpha andrenergic system will experience:
+improved mental clarity
+less tiredness
+possibly less anxiety
+possibly improved mood
MORE NAPHAZOLINE INFORMATION: (source: Mayo Clinic Health Oasis at www.mayohealth.org/usp/html/202389.htm)Medical Problems:
The presence of other medical problems may affect the use of ophthalmic naphazoline. Make sure you tell your doctor if you have any other medical problems, especially:Diabetes mellitus (sugar diabetes) or
Heart disease or
High blood pressure or
Overactive thyroid-Use of ophthalmic naphazoline may make the condition worse
Eye disease, infection, or injury- the symptoms of the condition may be confused with possible side effects of ophthalmic naphazolineTo use:
First, wash your hands. With the middle finger, apply pressure to the inside corner of the eye (and continue to apply pressure for 1 or 2 minutes after the medicine has been placed in the eye). Tilt the head back and with the index finger of the same hand, pull the lower eyelid away from the eye to form a pouch. Drop the medicine into the pouch and gently close the eyes. Do not blink. Keep the eyes closed for 1 or 2 minutes to allow the medicine to be absorbed. To keep the medicine as germ-free as possible, do not touch the applicator tip to any surface (including the eye). Also, keep the container tightly closed.Side Effects of This Medicine:
With overuse or long-term use: Increase in eye irritationSymptoms of too much medicine being absorbed into the body: Dizziness; headache; increased sweating; nausea; nervousness; weakness
Symptoms of overdose: Decrease in body temperature; drowsiness; slow heartbeat; weakness (severe)
Posted by BillP on July 26, 2000, at 22:55:47
In reply to Re: ADRAFINIL makes me tired! Anyone else?? » Lynne, posted by shellie on July 23, 2000, at 10:14:26
I was interested in the part of the previous message copied below. I tried taking Provigil for a sleep problem (all by itself, no other medicines), and it made me extremely sedated. The doctor would hardly believe me, since Provigil is supposed to have exactly the opposite effect.
> > Does Adrafinil make anyone else tired? It doesn't matter if I take 300mgs or 1200mgs, I can't get off the couch. . . .
> Hi Lynne. I had the reaction to provigil that you are having to adrafinil--(they are related drugs . . .
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